Euro Elections - Vote Green to Stop the BNP

[Mike777]

'Best way to beat the BNP is to vote Green' from The Independent.

An anti-racism campaigner has emerged as the candidate who could stop the British National Party chairman Nick Griffin winning a seat in the European Parliament next month.


Peter Cranie has been chosen by the Green Party to stand in the North-west, where the BNP's hopes of winning its first seats in a nationwide election are highest. Respect, the left-wing party headed by the Bethnal Green and Bow MP George Galloway, has stood aside in the region and is urging its supporters to vote Green to stop the BNP.

The Greens, who already have two MEPs, are making a major push in the North-west. They are convinced that that the proportional representation (PR) system used in the 4 June elections makes voting Green the best way of denying the BNP victory and the significant boost in funds from the Strasbourg parliament that would follow.

Full story here http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/best-way-to-beat-the-bnp-is-to-vote-green-1678539.html

[Strategist]

It's also the best tactic in London, South East & Soith West England...

[Mike777]

Yes, it's a complicated voting system, but basically you are about 3 or 4 times more likely to keep the BNP out by voting Green, rather than Lab, LD or Tory. Voting for other small parties are a complete waste in most areas.

I've noticed locally and nationally the big parties are not bothering with this election much, saving their money and energy for the general election. As far as I know, locally, the Greens are the only party leafleting at the moment about the Euro election.

I hope we retain our seat in London, Jean Lambert is a good MEP, and it is a bonus if we keep the fascists out.

[willp]

Labour says Vote Labour to stop the BNP. The Tories say vote Conservative to stop the BNP. The Greens say vote Green to stop the BNP.
Wow, this BNP must be a mighty superpower, so much so that we have to subordinate everything else to stopping them! What's the reality?
They have no MPs, a handful of councillors, and virtually no popular support.

In a recent poll for the BBC, 55% said, “I want Britain to leave the EU.” 84% said the British people must have a referendum before any more powers go to the EU.
In the EU elections, the EU’s leaders, including the leaders of the failed parliamentary parties, Con-Lab-Lib-Green, are all desperate for us to vote, so they can claim people support the EU.
The BNP is just the bait to tempt the gullible into voting for the EU.
But we don't support the undemocratic EU, so we shouldn't vote for any of them.

[Mike777]

EU does important work on employment, environment and human rights.

I'm a bit of Eurosceptic myself, but I think most people in this country want to remain in the EU.

As for the BNP, they have a London Assembley member now, and could quite easily win a European Parliament seat. We should not be complacent about such a party winning representation.

Small parties with an existing constituency have the best chance of depriving them of a seat in these elections, because of the PR nature of them. A high turn out (which is unlikely to happen) is also a way of depriving them of a breakthrough.

[Brigg57]

Mike,
I agree with you. being very sceptical about a European Union which operates in a capitalist environment doesn't mean being anti-European. It's a question of building a socialist movement across Europe.

Labour is expecting a massive drop in support. My worry is that the BNP will pick up on some of that and build some momentum. It's not a major player by any means, but neither are the Left. The politics of the Left - whether the RP/Compass Left or the Green Left, strike me as undeveloped, unconvincing in terms of a power alternative. That fits in with Charlie's worry about the need for a programme which is convincing.

The worry about the BNP is that as the economic recession bites - in the form of a vicious cutback in public spending - tehre could be a rapid shift in political scene. I don't see a revived nationalist movement such as BNP as a real threat, any more than Mosely's Fascists were in the 30s, but they couuld shape political debate. Another bang like last autumn, and all bets about the BNP or anything else are off, ofc ourse.

[rodge]

i have just caught sight of willps' contribution in the dictatorship of the proletariat disscussion ....it seems from him that m.e.ps have just awarded themselves a £13000 pay increase...protected by a low tax band ......needless to say i shall not be voting ...simple as that .not even to teach Labour a lesson .as yet i have not met anyone who intends voting in the eec elections so i dont feel entirely isolated .

[Mike777]

There are many problems with the EU and I expect turn out to be low, perhaps under 30%. But the danger is that this makes it easier for the BNP to win seats. If you don't vote, you may in effect contribute to BNP success.

[rodge]

mike.....the drop in support for labour is richly deserved.chickens coming home to roost as they say .one might also say ..that support for the eec is also at an all time low .... are all these people wrong ? As we have not had the promised referendum...unlike ireland.. on eec intergration we can show our contempt by withdrawing support for any of the parties. to me its a win-win situation if ever i have seen one . i hope nobody who reads these postings gets nightmares about bnp, time will tell no doubt . the very fact that folk are alienated from the eec circus fills me with joy. its the beginning of wisdom ........not the road to hell !

[Mike777]

Yes rodge, Labour is crap these days, but why not vote for a left wing party, and the Greens are best placed of the left parties to win seats and stop the BNP winning any.

Check out the green Party's policies here http://www.greenparty.org.uk/news. You will find them not disimiliar to what Labour used to stand for.

If the BNP get MEP's they will get extra resources (money) and they will undoubtably grow bigger, and that is a danger.

[CharlieMcMenamin]

I think Mike is right on a number of  grounds:

1. It is important to vote in any contest the BNP stand in (even for community dog catcher or whatever the UK equivalent might be - Parish Council I suppose), in order to demonstrate that they truly are a tiny minority of opinion;
2. EU withdrawal is ridiculous as a policy, whatever criticisms might be fairly directed at that obviously less than than democratic institution.  It is ridiculous because of the 'open' nature of the British economy and our need to trade with other nations. So voting for Bob Crowe's/ Socialist Party's / CPB's No2EU platform is a bit...well daft.
3. There is massive disillusionment with Labour at the moment- it's a fair bet that an awful lot of the Labour vote is going to sit in its hands and stay at home, and some may shift to the BNP. We have to counter that.

But, hey, I vote Green anyway (despite not being a party member, or even particularly 'philosophically' green).  I might vote Plaid in Wales - but I'm not Welsh, and since I want to register a vote for a credible party to the left of this dire New Labour Government it has to be Green for me. 

[willp]

Charlie, Switzerland and Norway are not EU members and still trade with the EU.
So your arguments against withdrawal don't hold water.
The idea that we must participate in EU elections to keep out the BNP is a last desperate attempt by discredited bourgeois politicians to get somebody to vote for them.
The low turnout for the BNP in itself "demonstrates that they truly are a tiny minority of opinion". We don't need to vote for somebody else to prove that only a few crazies support the BNP scum.

A leader in The Times on 11 May argued that the mainstream UK political parties must do more to make the case for voting in the European elections to counter the threat of the British National Party. When The Times, the voice of the ruling class, starts advocating your ideas, surely you should beware.

But the majority of the British people don’t support the undemocratic EU, so we shouldn’t support any of them by voting.
We need a referendum, not yet another meaningless EU election.

[Mike777]

Will.

The EU is not meaningless. The English Green MEP’s led the campaign for the UK’s Working Time Directive opt out to be scrapped. This is just one example of important work being done in the European Parliament.

Fair enough, all parties need to put out a positive message, it’s not sufficient to just say vote to keep the BNP out.But how does assisting the BNP to gain seats by not voting help any kind of progressive cause?

[CharlieMcMenamin]

Willp

The question of whether the UK could survive outside is one thing- it certainly could, though I do note your own programme involves quite a widescale return to the land and a form of autarky which would undoubtedly lead to a massive drop in living standards. The question is rather: is such a move in our economic interests - and I'm firmly of the view it is not.

We need to democratise the institutions of the EU, not leave them. I think this might involve, in the short term, rejecting the Lisbon Treaty if we ever get a referendum on it - but not voting for withdrawal. 

[Mike777]

From RESPECT http://www.therespectparty.net/breakingnews.php?id=582.

And the rumour is that Salma Yaqoob will endorse the Greens in West Midlands.

Euro Elections: Respect in the North West says unite red and green to stop the BNP

With a headline including the words 'European Elections' it's a good bet than many people will think this article isn't for them. After all the majority of people don't vote in these elections which come round every five years. Those who do vote often never hear from those they have elected for the next five years.
So you could be forgiven for thinking that this summer's European Parliament elections, to be held on 4th June, can be safely put into the box marked – 'not important or relevant to me.' But to do that this year could mean waking up on 5th June to a very ugly fright.

The British National Party have declared their intention to stand in these elections - and to head their list in the North West with their leader Nick Griffin.

Because these elections are held under a system of proportional representation this means that a party only needs around 8% of the vote to win a seat.

If those who are opposed to the racist and anti-worker policies of the BNP stay at home on election day then this fascist party will have a greater chance of winning one seat. That would give their leader a office with a large budget and the electoral credibility to allow him into our newspapers and onto our television sets. It would be a disaster for community relations across the North West and beyond.

As the election approaches you may hear from New Labour supporters that the only way to stop the BNP is to vote Labour. This is a bit rich considering it is the disillusionment with Blair and Brown plus their pandering to the right wing press on issues like immigration and asylum that have allowed the BNP to grow.

But many people simply can't stomach the idea of voting Labour again.

In such circumstances those who oppose the BNP must take the danger of them winning a seat very seriously indeed. It is for this reason that Respect have decided not to stand in this year's Euro-elections but, instead, to ask our supporters vote for the Green Party list headed by Peter Cranie. We did not take this decision lightly but we genuinely believe that the votes of both Respect and Green Party are better combined than divided. Respect has a number of political differences with the Greens but we are confident that their lead candidate, Peter Cranie – who has a consistent record of anti-racism and issues such as support for Palestine - would make an excellent, progressive MEP.

So please ensure that you are registered to vote before these elections in June – and when the day arrives please don't stay at home. This year your vote really does matter.

[wolfysmith]

I agree with Charlie that in the past the EU has been beneficial to the labour movement in that it was a check on Thatcherism and Blairism but the Lisbon Treaty will enforce those very neo-liberal and neo-conservative economic and political policies onto the peoples of Britain and Europe. The only political group that represents a serious counterbalance to the Conservative and New-Labour parties and the fascist BNP is the left unit group. I therefore feel that a Vote for No2EU – Yes to Democracy   

As the only truly socialist group with the Communist Party of Britain, Socialist Party and Alliance for Green Socialism which makes a better choice for socialist to vote for than the Green Party.

No2EU – Yes to Democracy have clashed with members of the BNP in Carlisle. Shoppers told No2EU – Yes to Democracy campaigners that they were delighted to see someone with the courage to stand up to the BNP.

Also in Europe there is the Left-Green Socialists Alliance the GUE/NGL which is expected to gain votes on the EU election. This group is made up of eco-socialist and Marxist parties that are pro and anti the European Union but are united as a left alternative to the social democratic parties which includes the British Labour Party. If the British socialist and communist parties do well they could form an alliance with the GUE/NGL thus strengthening the Left-Green Socialists alliance in Europe.

Websites:    http://www.greensocialist.org.uk/
      http://www.socialistparty.org.uk/
      http://www.communist-party.org.uk/
      http://www.no2eu.com/

      http://www.guengl.eu/   
      http://www.nordic-green-left-alliance.org/

      http://21stcenturymanifesto.wordpress.com/
      http://www.gptu.net/gleft/greenleft.shtml
      http://www.hopenothate.org.uk/

For further reading go to: http://www.communist-party.org.uk/ midlands communists

website
Resources
Cuban Eco-Agriculture
 Further thoughts on the Political Ecology of Marx By Andrew Robinson (2008)
 Euro Election Left Unity Marxist media theory & Oxfam’s campaign that international news coverage remains on our TV screens

[CharlieMcMenamin]

Wolfie,
you say

....in Europe there is the Left-Green Socialists Alliance the GUE/NGL which is expected to gain votes on the EU election. This group is made up of eco-socialist and Marxist parties that are pro and anti the European Union but are united as a left alternative to the social democratic parties which includes the British Labour Party. If the British socialist and communist parties do well they could form an alliance with the GUE/NGL thus strengthening the Left-Green Socialists alliance in Europe.

But the NO2EU website says if elected their candidates won't take up their seats.

The Lisbon Treaty is something I disagree with as well. But its' primary importance is surely the way it abrogates democratic decision making rights to a

unelected EU commission  [which] would propose all EU law which would then be imposed on member states by the council of ministers mostly on the basis of qualified majority voting.

Or so says the No2EU website, anyway.

The EU is a source of neoliberal trade policy - but possibly its only a conduit of some of the more important elements of such policy, given it signs up to World Trade organisation deals. We'd be at the mercy of such WTO rules in or out of the EU.

[Mike777]

No2EU seems to have been set up by the RMT leadership, in rather undemocratic fashion.

The nationalistic tone of much of their policies is a concern, but I don't see them getting more 1 or 2%. Another small party on the left, yep that's just what we need, not.

If they take some votes off UKIP and BNP then that is something I suppose.

[wolfysmith]

I think it will be up to individuals to decide if elected whether they take up their position as an MEP. You comments about the WTO rules are true as the directive for marketization of Health Care, the Royal Mail and Rail Services all originate from the WTO enforced by the IMF and World Bank. For this reason a Marxist understanding of global capitalism is required and the only group that has this is the No2EU left unity alliance. Avtar Sadiq has an article in the Morning Star today which puts a good case for voting No2EU in the European election. Avtar Sadiq is the Unity for Peace and Socialism candidate for the East Midlands left unity progressive alliance No2EU – Yes to Democracy. He is definitely worth voting for against neo-liberalism, neo-conservatism, and privatisation and to stop the BNP.

It is true that the RMT initiated the idea of No2EU, and that the CPB believes in each country finding its own road to socialism. But as socialists and Marxists all the parties and progressive movements involved is internationalist. 

Hopefully they will take votes from UKIP and BNP and New-Labour, whose slavish adherence to neo-conservative and neo-liberalism will mean the return of a Thatcherite Conservative government in Britain next year. 

Avtar Sadiq article in the Morning Star can be found at:

http://www.morningstaronline.co.uk/index.php/features/banks_get_billions_we_get

[Mike777]

A poll by ComRes taken on 14th May, has a topline figure of...

CON 28%, LAB 23%, LDEM 14%, UKIP 15%, GRN 11%, BNP 4%.

Looks like the Greens will do well out of the MP's expenses debacle.